How many former Tory voters in Battersea or Merton will be voting differently this time? Post Reply

[storm35]

Punctured Bicycle, please go out onto the streets of Battersea in the next 4 weeks and tell the good people what you have just written . You have absolutely hit the nail on the head.
I know from a previous thread Katherine H is from Tooting and has the Labour Brexit rebel Rosena, so I understand her position, but Battersea has a chance to fight back also.

[KatherineHepburn]

And there's Chuka in Streatham.
It's a case of getting behind the person who is willing to fight the hardest for Remain in Battersea and I believe that to be the Lib Dem candidate.
(And the NHS while they're at it!)

[GuyD73]

OK, first things first. Scotov, I’m afraid you win, hands down, the prize for most daft comment on this thread. Who am I? I’m reasonably well known on this forum and other local ones. I’m a local dad, running a tiny fish business, who’s appalled that my two young daughters will not enjoy the freedoms afforded by our EU membership that my generation has enjoyed.
There is nothing parochial or partisan about my views, it seems they are shared by many on here, you just don’t happen to agree with them, and I did vote Tory in both 2010 and 2015 because I thought they were the safest pair of hands for the economy at the time. Your loony suggestion that I’m some sort of lefty plant or infiltrator had me in stitches though, so thanks for the laughs.
Don’t know what has emerged about the Crick thing but he’s a reasonably respected journalist, so it seems unlikely he’d lie about something like that and in any case May’s avoidance of real people and preference for stage managed, invite only events (like the one in a shed deep in the woods in Scotland), have been pretty well documented by the mainstream media.
So, to Denwand. Gosh the insults are soooo hurtful!
"Mayhem" is neither apt or witty, it reflects a childish fifth-form attitude to political comment and has no place in constructive, adult discussion.
It is entirely apt I’m afraid, for the reasons I made clear in one of my posts, which I notice you did not care to dispute, here’s a little recap for you….
She definitely believed that the UK was Stronger IN, then on a 48/52 split she changed her mind (not that anyone else in the country is to be given that chance).
She was against Heathrow expansion and now she's for it. Add to that broken manifesto promises on national insurance contributions, voting rights of Brits living abroad, among other things, then you have a weak, flip-flopping PM.
A constructive, adult comment, rather than a fifth-form insult would be most welcome!
Again, this an opinion echoed by a number of other people on here, so if you dismiss this as ‘nonsense’ Scotov, you’re insulting rather more folk than just me.
Beyond this particular thread Denwand, and notwithstanding our other little spats on here that are of no consequence, I am starting to feel genuinely sorry for you. I’m pretty angry about Brexit, but you seem to be angry about everything, with an awful lot of people, a great deal of the time. You also seem to get into unpleasant arguments with other NVNers frequently and have real difficulty having any kind of respect for any sort of opinion that differs from yours. This would seem to me to be indicative of a person who hasn’t got many good things in their life, so for that, you have my sincere sympathy, and I hope things get better for you x
Anyway, on a more upbeat note, I’m really grateful for all the people who have positively engaged with my post. It’s heartening to know that many are thinking carefully about tactical voting, that many former tory voters are voting differently this time, and that there is such support for the Lib dems. It’s precisely why I asked the question to get insights like this.
Another question for you all – what does everyone feel about the intransigence of Labour, other than the poor Surrey lot who got sacked, (& to an extent LDs) to enter into even unofficial local arrangements to try and oust sitting Tory MPs? The greens are leading the progressive alliance in this respect, it’s a shame the other parties can’t see past tribalism, see the merit in it and reciprocate.
May this thread run and run. Peace everyone #Stopbrexit

[Denwand]

Oh GuyD73...Really!

Thanks for your pencil sketch of my character and personal remarks....so much to pick over there but I'm reminded of Churchill's quote paraphrased to...

"There is nothing so satisfying as being shot at with no result"

I also like the way you paint yourself as a curious and detached observer on this site and yet you have started thread after thread here trying to recruit those of a fellow mind to join public demonstrations against Brexit to tactically vote against Brexit and to vote LibDem in Battersea. Hmm more political activist than observer I'd suggest

Well jolly good luck to you - I think you should as I understand your self confessed anger at the Brexit result of 52% / 48% in favour. That 4% swing against you must be irritating in the extreme!

Well the facts have changed and the ground has shifted (which will either reassure you or make you even more angry)...

The latest YouGov poll shows that it is not 48% who want to oppose Brexit anymore...it has dribbled down to only 22% of the electorate.

Source YouGov May 12th 2017

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/05/12/fo ... -electora/

Of course respect your views but not your argument as ever, but we will never agree so no point in banging on trying to convince me - carry on the good work!

Good bye and good luck!

[storm35]

This study is based on a sample size of 5,000 people? Not really representative of 46.5 million voters is it.

[KatherineHepburn]

Denwand, I am curious, why do you keep telling people that you will never agree with them and then 'good bye'?
If you are intending to leave, why do you keep coming back?
Or are you hoping that by being so rude, dismissive and sarcastic that anyone who disagrees with you or questions your beliefs will just sod off?
Perhaps by just telling people to 'give up' protesting against Brexit or protecting the NHS you are hoping to add to the voter suppression already taking place?

[Punctured Bicycle]

Any thoughts on the Conservative manifesto? It seems fairly regressive. Curbs on non-EU immigration, increased charges for employing non-EU workers and higher health care costs for non-EU nationals. Thankfully EU citizens are protected from this sort of discrimination for the time being but certainly a glimpse of things to come under Theresa May's Conservative Nationalism.

[KatherineHepburn]

It certainly makes for fairly grim reading. Cutting free school lunches is a bit low.
Are they really wanting to reach out to the UKIP supporters that much? Why? There is just such an emphasis on immigration.

[Denwand]

This study is based on a sample size of 5,000 people? Not really representative of 46.5 million voters is it.

Hi Misty!

excellent point.I mean what do YouGov know about polls after all?

What size is your sample based on?

[Denwand]

Denwand, I am curious, why do you keep telling people that you will never agree with them and then 'good bye'?
If you are intending to leave, why do you keep coming back?

I know!

Unfortunately people keep posting ridiculous and unfounded character assessments of me therefore goading me into a required response!

Like someone who thought it might be a shock to my system to read the Guardian or infering that I get my views from the Daily Mail Online site, things like that!

[storm35]

Denwand, what on earth are you talking about. I dont have a sample. 46.5 million is the official number of people with a right to vote as per the Office for National Statistics. Do you need anything more official than that?

[Punctured Bicycle]

The changes on social care are interesting. Pensioners will have to pay for their social care until savings and assets are depleted to £100k. After death the cost of care will be recouped from the estate. Seems rather a disinstive to save (or at least an opportunity for creative estate planning)

[Denwand]

Denwand, what on earth are you talking about. I dont have a sample. 46.5 million is the official number of people with a right to vote as per the Office for National Statistics. Do you need anything more official than that?

Oh dear.

Polling companies do not ask every voter in the UK in order to conduct a poll - 46 million people - by nature they need a scientific (of course there are variances as we know) cross section of the voters....which will necessarily be less than the total number of voters.

If y0u are casting doubt on the erosion of the Remain vote to 22% down from 48% because of the "small sample".

Do you think it has increased since the Referendum or do you think the 22% pro-Remain count is actually less than that...maybe only 10% being pro-Remain now (sorry but you don't make that at all clear )

I am asking what are you basing your judgement of the current Remain vote on?

[Alchemy]

Is there a website where you can compare your local candidates' positions on key issues?

For example, Jane Ellison's view on school funding cuts seems quite difficult to establish, so I have to assume shell be toeing the party line -- which would make her unelectable to me.

[storm35]

I have not passed a judgement on the current Remain vote? Why do you constantly like to make things up about people? I understand perfectly how YouGov works thankyou very much (so you can stop with the patronising), but I do simply not believe that this recent YouGov poll should be taken as given and we should all throw our hands in the air and say, well thats it. You are calling them facts, but they can be moveable facts.